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Delta Green Kickstarter launched

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cpt_machine

Looking forward for the PDF bundle (fingers crossed we get the King in Yellow Campaign) and I'll be picking up a hard copy at my FLGS for the book I want in dead tree.

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skaye

As of the latest Kickstarter update, Arc Dream has provided shipping estimates to various countries in the EU and elsewhere. They specifically note an arrangement with Editions Sans Detour for Europe. Full details I leave to Arc Dream, but if costs are higher than estimates they'll let people know beforehand and give the option of canceling delivery, and if they find a way to lower costs they'll update the pricing info.

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christian

I'm thrilled by this latest update

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Jiminy

+1 for [REDACTED] within Update #24.

 

"Energise the EU hardcopy cannon!"

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yockenthwaite

Yes I'm thrilled too. Well done to Arc Dream.

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dce

Life is still pretty grim for those of us "down under" ... but I'm pleased that EU folks are getting cheaper DG shipping. Here's hoping it drives the campaign onwards to unlock some more stretch goals.

 

 

Dean (from Adelaide)

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clockworkjoe

Comment from one of the KS backers:  If you go through Australia Post's Shopmate you can ship a 500 gram book for $AU 27 + $AU5 for each additional book in the same package. Expensive, but still quite a bit less than $US30 + 10. https://shopmate.auspost.com.au/our-rates/shipping-rates

 

I and Arc Dream have no experience with this service, but it sounds promising.

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FreddieF

Shipping is still too expensive for me and it looks like I can't front up the money for physical copies in advance. I'll have to wait for retail. I've dropped my pledge to PDFs only, so a Hard Targets level has become open if anyone here wants to jump on it.

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Count_Zero

Living in South Africa, the $30 shipping and our horrendous exchange rate have also forced me to only pledge for the pdfs.

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Shrike

I'm very pleased to see in the update this morning by Arc Dream that they've reduced the shipping rates to Canada - and the UK - dramatically.

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Jiminy

+2 for [REDACTED] within Update #29. "UK delivery cannon ready for action!"

 

Shrike is indubitably correct. The cost is currently just an extra three dollars ($3) per physical item for shipping to the UK.

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skaye

Details on new Canada and UK shipping costs: for Canada $6 for one copy of a given product and no cost for additional copies, for the UK $3 for one copy of a given product and $3 for each additional copy.

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PoC

Arc Dream have posted a KS comment about the print runs for the DG:RPG materials:

 

...the print runs are going to be tailored for the Kickstarter orders and it may take a bit to get them out to press again (if enough people want them). This locks you in for a copy. I wouldn't want it to be like COUNTDOWN again — something vanishes from print for 10 years.

Source: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/arcdream/delta-green-the-role-playing-game/comments

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Emrys

I must be misunderstanding something because to me:

 

...the print runs are going to be tailored for the Kickstarter orders and it may take a bit to get them out to press again (if enough people want them).

 

flat-out contradicts:

 

I wouldn't want it to be like COUNTDOWN again — something vanishes from print for 10 years.


Unless enough people want hard copies, doesn't this decision guarantee that they will be unavailable as soon as the KS rewards are shipped?

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dennisd

I must be misunderstanding something because to me:

flat-out contradicts:

 

Unless enough people want hard copies, doesn't this decision guarantee that they will be unavailable as soon as the KS rewards are shipped?

 

We will be printing as many hardbacks as were ordered in the KS, along with enough to make it the most cost effective print job. No more. This may mean there are 50 extra, 500 or 1000. Those who kick in get the hardback. Those waiting to get it in retail, they may have to wait...longer.

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Count_Zero

We will be printing as many hardbacks as were ordered in the KS, along with enough to make it the most cost effective print job. No more. This may mean there are 50 extra, 500 or 1000. Those who kick in get the hardback. Those waiting to get it in retail, they may have to wait...longer.

 

Would there not be the option of POD, like the original Delta Green books are? 

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dennisd

Not likely. PDFs for certain. No final decisions yet.

 

-D

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FreddieF

I'm slightly annoyed with this whole project now. I was hoping to get the books at retail as I can't stump up the hundreds of dollars for books and shipping right now, but now we're told that non-Kickstarter hard copies are likely to be limited. The emphasis here seems to be getting fans to throw as much money at the project in advance. For those of us who can't afford to do so, that fact that we might not get a chance to pick up the hard copies later, or at least struggle to do so, is a bit of a kick in the teeth.

 

I've now cancelled my pledge and I'll divert the money into other products that I can at least enjoy playing now. I'll just have to hope that I can get the new DG books through my FLGS later on, but if not I at least have plenty of Chaosium, Pelgrane Press and Cubicle 7 Cthulhu books to run. At least I'll be able to get my DG fix through Fall of Delta Green from Pelgrane later on as well.

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PoC

At least I'll be able to get my DG fix through Fall of Delta Green from Pelgrane later on as well.

 

Considering the authors and publishers of Fall of Delta Green, plus the fact it's a somewhat different setting/period, then of all, this is probably the one I'm most interested in!

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Count_Zero

I'm inclined to agree with xthawx. The implied message seems to be get it now or you might not get  it at all. 

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FreddieF

Considering the authors and publishers of Fall of Delta Green, plus the fact it's a somewhat different setting/period, then of all, this is probably the one I'm most interested in!

Plus (and granted this probably doesn't apply to you, Paul) it's Gumshoe!

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cpt_machine

I've backed projects in the past because the authors couldn't guarantee it would reach store shelves to have it later appear in shops. I suspect that Arc Dreams are playing it safe due to the high cost of print runs and that the campaign has not yet ended.

 

I hope that with the success of the campaign it would be evident that the demand for the game is out there and that Arc Dream doesn't assume that their only customers are the ones backing the kickstarter. I would at the very least expect once this is all over and done a POD would be availed for purchase or even a physical copy I can buy at my FLGS.

While I'm trying to understand both sides it does leave a dry taste in my mouth too as I don't have the money to put down on hard copies I really want. I'm down for the $80 pdf pledge but I expect to be able to get a physical copy of the Rulebook and GM screen on the future via mediums other than the kickstarter.

To be honest as I rule I tend to avoid massive kickstarter products unless the stretch goals are something I really want. I didn't back CoC 7th, London Boxset or HotOE because I knew they would be on store shelves in the future. I got 2 out of the 3 from my FLGS and the latter is delayed for reasons we all now know.

We live (and game) in a different time period as when Countdown was release and now if there is demand a publisher is leaving money on the table of they don't offer a versions for puchase so I hope we don't have a situation where there is clear demand for a product that isn't being filled. Don't let me down Arc Dream, I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt for now.

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PST

I'm slightly annoyed with this whole project now. I was hoping to get the books at retail as I can't stump up the hundreds of dollars for books and shipping right now, but now we're told that non-Kickstarter hard copies are likely to be limited. The emphasis here seems to be getting fans to throw as much money at the project in advance. For those of us who can't afford to do so, that fact that we might not get a chance to pick up the hard copies later, or at least struggle to do so, is a bit of a kick in the teeth.

 

I've now cancelled my pledge and I'll divert the money into other products that I can at least enjoy playing now. I'll just have to hope that I can get the new DG books through my FLGS later on, but if not I at least have plenty of Chaosium, Pelgrane Press and Cubicle 7 Cthulhu books to run. At least I'll be able to get my DG fix through Fall of Delta Green from Pelgrane later on as well.

 

I think the emphasis from the start has been to cover the writing, art, editing, layout, distribution and printing costs for the books.

 

Something such as, say, Deep State might only get 200 people purchasing it via the Kickstarter. So should Arc Dream then do a 5000 print run in the hope that it still sells in a reasonable period of time (and tie up money until then, not seeing a return on it for 3-4 years)? Assorted companies (Evil Hat, Pelgrane, Posthuman Studios) have put up lots of details over the years on how long it can take to see a return on a product.

 

Before printing and distribution costs, Control Group (as an example) will be easily $20k, if not $25k of costs (actually it might be higher as I remember Arc Dream having very good rates for pay). Printing 3000 copies (say) would be another $12-15k (and could go much, much higher than that depending on assorted factors). In that case then there'd be lots of copies, but there won't be any profit until those start selling, which could take 3 years to sell through.

 

I'm sure that books will come out to retail, but how many and how long they're available for isn't something they can guarantee right now, so they're simply making it clear that they can guarantee getting the books in hardcover via the kickstarter, if you wait until later then it's entirely possible that won't happen. They're being cautious and realistic, there's nothing underhand going on.

 

Given how they've lost money on DG books in the past (and of course been badly stung by fulfillment company collapses), I really can't blame them for being cautious and not wanting to end up out of pocket for 10s of thousands of dollars again. Yes I'd have loved to see more stretch goals and more risk, but it's their company and their lives being taken up with this for the next year+.

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